Author Topic: advice for new camera  (Read 16067 times)

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Offline Jeromy

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advice for new camera
« on: February 16, 2009, 06:57:29 pm »
I'm getting to the point where i'll soon be able to put a camera on my helmet, and i'd like to be ready to do it when i can.  First though, i'd appreciate any advice/tips etc any one has.

I'm looking for a good camera to use, but hopefully in-expensively.  I don't really want anything as big as the normaly sized camera that everyone uses to film tandems - i have no graduer dreams of being able to do that for a year or two at least, so i can save that expense for then.  What i'm looking for is something that will be small and compact, and hopefully save video to an SD card.

Basically, i just want something that i can use to record POV-type video on my own jumps - not to do 'camera flyer' jumps recording others. just something good enough to see what happened in the jump etc..

I saw one camera that two AFF instructors were using in eloy, but they were pretty busy preping their student, so i didn't bother them to ask about the camera.  just  a cylinder shape, about 1 1/2 diameter, maybe 4 inches long.  it seemed about the right size that i'm looking for..  anyone have any ideas what it might have been?
whatever will i do to entertain myself on cloudy days....

Offline Foster

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2009, 09:41:15 am »
The camera they were using in Eloy is a flash memory based cam, Sony CX10 or 12 is an example.  Unfortunately the image stabilization on those cameras causes major issues with video quality especially in a sit fly.

Don't waste your money on a camera anytime soon just spend it on jumps.  200 is the minimum and last season I thought that was plenty but after actually putting the camera on my head I realized why everyone disagrees with that minimum. 

Next time you see me bring this up I'd be happy to discuss it with you... 

Offline Jeremy

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2009, 10:38:09 am »
Inside footage on belly jumps is just about worthless, too. Unless you have a really, really, really wide-angle lens, you'll miss about 90% of the jump. I had some inside footage on a belly jump somewhere, if I find it I'll post it and show you what I mean.

Offline Rhanold

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2009, 01:36:55 pm »
The camera they were using in Eloy is a flash memory based cam, Sony CX10 or 12 is an example.  Unfortunately the image stabilization on those cameras causes major issues with video quality especially in a sit fly.

Don't waste your money on a camera anytime soon just spend it on jumps.  200 is the minimum and last season I thought that was plenty but after actually putting the camera on my head I realized why everyone disagrees with that minimum. 

Next time you see me bring this up I'd be happy to discuss it with you... 

Holly Crap!!! A usefull post from Foster?!?!? I never thought I'd see the day. Bravo Foster! Bravo!

Offline Jeromy

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2009, 03:07:49 pm »
The camera they were using in Eloy is a flash memory based cam, Sony CX10 or 12 is an example.

those ones are close, but the one i saw was more compact, had a lot smaller lcd, and the lcd was on the back of the camera..  just a plain tube shape, lens on one end, lcd on the other...

yeah, i agree with everyone mostly, and i won't be rushing out to buy anything too soon, but hopefully this season
whatever will i do to entertain myself on cloudy days....

Offline LAPaul

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2009, 09:56:14 pm »
The camera they were using in Eloy is a flash memory based cam, Sony CX10 or 12 is an example.

those ones are close, but the one i saw was more compact, had a lot smaller lcd, and the lcd was on the back of the camera..  just a plain tube shape, lens on one end, lcd on the other...

yeah, i agree with everyone mostly, and i won't be rushing out to buy anything too soon, but hopefully this season

I've seen some lipstick cameras that arew marketed to motorcyclists that fit a similar description.  Evan used to jump something similar.

From what I understood when I read up on it, the quality is not very good at-all unless you go for the super-high-end equipment, which is why you dont see many in skydiving. 

I cant remember the name of the manufacturers now but if you google lipstick cam you might find some more...

Offline Foster

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2009, 10:18:34 am »
The camera they were using in Eloy is a flash memory based cam, Sony CX10 or 12 is an example.  Unfortunately the image stabilization on those cameras causes major issues with video quality especially in a sit fly.

Don't waste your money on a camera anytime soon just spend it on jumps.  200 is the minimum and last season I thought that was plenty but after actually putting the camera on my head I realized why everyone disagrees with that minimum. 

Next time you see me bring this up I'd be happy to discuss it with you... 

Holly Crap!!! A usefull post from Foster?!?!? I never thought I'd see the day. Bravo Foster! Bravo!

LOL Ryan, yes I am capable of learning and while the post is useful, accurate, and honest... just as I didnt listen to the exact same advice neither will he  ;D ;D ;D ;D

Minimum should be at least 300 if not 500 jumps...  I understand now why so few bother with flying video.

Offline Jeromy

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2009, 12:30:22 pm »
Quote
just as I didnt listen to the exact same advice neither will he

come on.. i *could* be listening...

Quote
Minimum should be at least 300 if not 500 jumps...

oh.. so you'll be putting your camera away for another hundred jumps or so?
whatever will i do to entertain myself on cloudy days....

Offline matter_kid

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2009, 01:49:36 pm »
Quote
just as I didnt listen to the exact same advice neither will he

come on.. i *could* be listening...

Quote
Minimum should be at least 300 if not 500 jumps...

oh.. so you'll be putting your camera away for another hundred jumps or so?

 ;)


"I would rather die on my feet then live on my knees"

Offline Foster

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2009, 02:31:41 pm »
Quote
just as I didnt listen to the exact same advice neither will he

come on.. i *could* be listening...

Quote
Minimum should be at least 300 if not 500 jumps...

oh.. so you'll be putting your camera away for another hundred jumps or so?

COME ON there were smilies after that statement!!! ;D ;D ;D

I limited wearing the camera for most jumps about midway through the season last year...  I pulled the lowest I've ever pulled before because of that stupid camera!!  I'm not really sure what I plan on doing this season in regard to flying video but I already made the 200 jump mistake so I can wear it AND be a hypocrite!!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D 

Offline Rhanold

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #10 on: February 20, 2009, 02:59:58 pm »
I limited wearing the camera for most jumps about midway through the season last year...  I pulled the lowest I've ever pulled before because of that stupid camera!!  

This is saying a lot for Foster. I believe I remember Dale saying if he saw Foster pulling in his basement one more time he was going to start charging rent.

I don't believe a camera can CAUSE you to pull low however it definitely can provide a distraction on every jump.

Offline Jeromy

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #11 on: February 20, 2009, 06:36:41 pm »
Quote
I don't believe a camera can CAUSE you to pull low however it definitely can provide a distraction on every jump.

At the risk of sounding stupid, as I've heard others make this comment, and they sure sounded stupid to me... but anyway...

I really planned on getting a small, simple, and (hopefully) cheap camera, putting it on my helmet, and other than turning it on before the jump, just forgetting about it.  Mostly just wanted some clips of everyone i fly with.... and maybe the end of the day trading footage if anyone got some of me..  seems like video is alway a good training tool, so to have some video, even if inside video isn't the best, would be better than nothing, right?

I don't really want to start learning how to "fly the camera" so to speak... more just keep on flying myself... with a camera.
whatever will i do to entertain myself on cloudy days....

Offline Franz

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #12 on: February 20, 2009, 11:36:01 pm »
The thing you are missing in this is that it doesn't matter how much you convince yourself you can set and forget
that simply isn't the case. It WILL be a distraction, from getting it ready on the ground to setting it on the plane
instead of checking your gear properly it may seem a small THING but it is one extra and significant THING.

If something goes wrong it won't be the only thing that made it happen but it will be a part of the chain of events.

Your running late for a load.    link 1
You throw your rig on in a hurry without checking it because your in a hurry. link2
You forgot your tape for your camera, so rush of to get that. link 3
You run to the plane without giving yourself that gear check and asking someone to check your pins link4  - second gear check missed!
You don't notice that you've knocked your cutaway handle loose cos it hasn't moved much yet. link 5
You're getting ready to exit people are huddling up in the door, you wait poised to start your camera. link 6 - 3rd  gear check missed.
Handle comes loose as you shuffle down the plane but you don't notice cos you're focused on starting that camera that you're going to ignore just as soon as you exit the plane. link 7

The chain of events is complete, all links in place:

You deploy your already cut-away main and don't even get video of it disappearing cos you're being a good boy and keeping your head down out of the way of that deploying canopy.
Now you feel nothing behind you... What's happening? is it the camera? did a riser snag it? Oh look I'm at a 1000ft with nothing above my head yet............
 


Offline Rhanold

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2009, 12:02:10 am »
You may think you are getting resistance to getting a camera... your not. the objection is coming from the attitude that you can put it on your head and it is no big deal. I rather see the first jumps with a camera concentrating on flying the camera and figuring out how you are going to maintain altitude awareness and dealing with the openings. Take Foster up on his offer and talk to him on the lessons he learned as well as Franz and myself. The size of the camera only saves strain on your neck.

Offline Jeromy

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Re: advice for new camera
« Reply #14 on: February 21, 2009, 01:10:57 pm »
Quote
The thing you are missing in this is that it doesn't matter how much you convince yourself you can set and forget that simply isn't the case. It WILL be a distraction, from getting it ready on the ground to setting it on the plane instead of checking your gear properly it may seem a small THING but it is one extra and significant THING.
is it as much for just fun jumping with it?  obviously video'ing a four way or a tandem or something, because you're expected to get the video.  but in the situation where the video doesn't matter, just a nice bonus if the video comes out at all...

Quote
You may think you are getting resistance to getting a camera... your not. the objection is coming from the attitude that you can put it on your head and it is no big deal.  I rather see the first jumps with a camera concentrating on flying the camera
Nope, getting exactly what i wanted and needed - qualified, experienced, and educated advice (okay, from everyone but foster ;) ;) ;) ;) )

What i meant by not "flying the camera" was just not trying to keep a target in focus.. if i need to turn my head to look at my alt, i do it, etc..  and trying not to be worried about getting good video, but just making a good jump, and maybe getting a few good clips at the end of the jump, end of the weekend, etc....

I'm interesting in doing this the right way, the safest way.. whatever that may be (other than waiting til 500 jumps!!).  That is of course why i brought it up here, instead of just showing up at the dz with a camera and hope no one noticed before i got a few loads in with it...

Quote
The size of the camera only saves strain on your neck.

Really?  this is the part that really surprises me.  it seems like having larger and more camera's, plus all the ring sights and such has got to add to the risk, so something smaller and more streamlined would be inherently safer.

whatever will i do to entertain myself on cloudy days....